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Baby, bathwater, bathtub, shower curtain...

from what i've read poking around here, it seems like most people here have retained at least some of their christian belief system. i'm wondering how many have not. my experience was, once i allowed myself to ask any of the questions i'd been suppressing for all those years, it wasn't long before i found myself pretty much back where i started. in fact, i was amazed at how quickly so much of what i'd been stuffing into my head and heart just fell away.i'm not looking for a fight here. i'm just curious. any other ex-christians out there?
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  • Jeff,
    "What I do know is that I am flawed in a way that continues to seem to be unfixable."

    What a flawless statement! Love it. It is one I can definitely relate to.

    God bless you in the name of our lord and savior Jesus Christ.
  • out, pretty much. i say "pretty much" because i think it's a cool book, and there's lots of good stuff in it. but "the revealed word and will of god?" nope!

    jeff, i'm happy to answer any questions you might have. but my suggestion is that you page through this blog thingy and read what i've written here thus far. i think it should give you a pretty good idea of where i'm at.

    and i'm not throwing out the toilet--where would i do my reading?
  • We don't have to go down into the valley of need...we're already there, Dailai Lama is here, too.
  • I don't know if I underestimate myself or if I don't. What I do know is that I am flawed in a way that continues to seem to be unfixable. I have learned the hard way that once I begin boasting in myself I start moving right own the ladder. So, I'll go on boasting about my weaknesses because my only hope and confidence, for me, is in Christ. Are there things I can brag about, sure, but I prefer not to elevate myself as I have seen what the results of such personal exaltations are too many times. Anyway, MS, the shower curtain, bathtub, (be sure and add the toilet), the baby, H2O that you have thrown out....did not include your belief in God. Bear with me further once more....Bible, in or out?
  • I hope you know I was just bustin your chops Charlene (aka Penworks), about that intelligent speaker. I apologize for being raised in KY. I am completely unsophisticated.

    I don't know, I think I will always be a Christian. It's a part of me from birth. I like it. But I will never go back to thinking I have all the answers in this life or judging anothers belief system UNLESS it is causing harm to others.

    George, truly no one is mocking God or Jesus Christ and certainly not you, as I see it, on this site. But yeah, this blog is not for everyone I suppose. I understand not participating in it.

    But how are we gonna save Michael and get him back in the fold if we ignore him? We gotta go down in the valley of need.

    (Again, just kidding. Too much coffee this halloween morning.)
  • George sounds like we have had many similar experiences in our youth. I understand where you are coming from.
  • Michael, what if you ended up going to heaven with all us Christians. Would you ask God to let you go somewhere else. Like maybe Limbo? smile.gif

    Limbo always seemed appealing to me when I was a kid growing up Catholic. If I recall it was heaven only God is not there. I think it is probably like the back part of the big top tent at Rock of Ages, the place where you could always find me, smokin and socializing and hanging out and not paying attention to the main stage happenings.

    Charlene, I think I would shoot myself if I had to listen to him for very long. (But I would do it in a peaceful way.) I remember seeing Ravi Shankar at some concert back in hippie days. That cool, masterful Indian Sitar music was ok for about 20 minutes but then I felt like screaming "Shut the fxxk up and bring the Allman Brothers back out"!!

    Jeff don't underestimate yourself. As I see it you have more than a few good qualities, man. And you are not stupid by a long shot. Jeff you asked that you are curious what others believe. I stated mine in a previous post. I will copy again here.

    "I still consider myself a Christian and a believer in most Christian values. And I also still believe in the God of the bible. But I do not take every bit of the bible at face value anymore. I believe the bible contains some great principles for living, however, and provides inspiration."
  • Lois,
    Are you kidding? I don't have to dim the lights and look at "those" colors...there is so much LSD, MDA, and THC residue in my blood and brain from the 70s that I don't even have to close my eyes to see colors or put on music to hear music. I could be stranded on a deserted island for years and still be entertained. I have to be careful when I'm on the Harley not to put on my headset and play Jimi Hendrix, Led Zeppelin, Stevie Ray Vaughn, etc., else the flashbacks come forth like a raging mighty tempest...talk about an inexpensive high...mind you I'm not complaining! However, speaking in tongues brings the better high and is less dangerous...especially with only two wheels on the ground, at least most of the time that is.
    Lois, please forgive me for misunderstanding your comments and your posting of the Donavon song. I might have over reacted? Though I might have been street toughened, I'm told I have a tender sensitive heart. I guess I am sometimes a little hyper-sensitive...especially when I feel, my Lord, the one who gave His life for me so that I could have life, is being mocked. It appears that was not your intention. Sorry I judged you.
    Went to your page...loved the poem bout the family dog.

    PS...for what it is worth to anyone, and that may be nothing, I do not live by definitions of the past, of any one man or woman, of any one ministry, or of anyone period. I just endeavor to believe the scriptures that are clear, especially those I believe were spoken by Jesus Christ. I don't think that any hurt of the past by anyone, any ministry, a gun to my head, or anything I can think of, would ever make me deny Jesus Christ as my Lord. In addition to that, the night I first spoke in tongues, on my own before God, for hours and hours, higher than I had ever been in my life, melting in the love from God, being freed from the terror of witchcraft, guilt, shame, and demons that had controlled my life, changed my life forever for good and truly gave me proof of the life, resurrection, and soon return of our Lord Jesus Christ. What a hope! What a joy to anticipate! Oh how I long to stand before and look into the face of Him who saved me by His grace... the King of all Kings, the Lord of all Lords! What a day, glorious day that will be! For me, without this, life would be very superficial and meaningless.

    Romans 8: 16-18

    The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

    And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

    For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.

    In the meantime, we can know Him intimately, to the end we seek Him. He will reveal Himself to us...He promised.

    John 14:21
    21He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.


    Jeremiah 29:13
    You will seek me and find me when you seek me with all your heart.


    Fare-thee- well, ye old "Baby, bathwater, bathtub, shower curtain..." I am closing the curtain on this one.

    Love and blessings!
    George
  • How did a blog that began with a simple question; any other ex-christians out there? turn into a conversation about "righteousness through Jesus Christ?"
    This was a simple observation I made. The conversation began with Michael's question and meandered through many conversations and ended up with “Righteousness through Jesus Christ”. I wasn't passing judgment one way or another on the direction the blog had taken, merely making an observation.
    Now concerning my question asking if there are any Righteous Wiccans Out There? Yes George, surely I gest. I would like to remind you that tomorrow is Halloween and it's a time when all little ghosts and goblins, witches, and power rangers, princesses, pirates etc. go trick-or- treating. I wasn't trying to bust anyone's chops with this song as John R. suggested. I posted the song because it's Halloween, nothing more, nothing less. I too went and saw Donovan a couple of years ago. Actually, I found the concert a little disappointing but that's not the topic right now. It certainly wasn't my intention to mock what you hold so dear to your heart. It just happened that your post and John R. post came right before mine. I know everything is out of sync now because you made a correction on your post.
    I also found that if you dim the lights, listen to “Season of the Witch” and stare at the computer screen with those colors from You Tube then you don't even need any of the Reefer you seemed to know so much about. (okay, now I'm busting chops).
    So, I hope that clears up any misunderstanding; but thanks anyway for the teaching about Witch Craft. I'll make sure to forward that on to Donovan the next time I see him:-)
    Happy Halloween!!!
  • yes, jeff, i do.
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